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Issue #1486 - Tuesday, July 8, 2003 - Editor: Jerry

Martin Jordan NDS  

Well Gene,
this is Ken Wilber speaking.
I appreciate your comments regarding my work
and like to make a few comments
-- just to get perspectives right.

First of all in the context of a postmetaphysic
integralistic approach to Wilberism i have
to admit that your statments are true,
simply because everybody is right in the first place.
Although there seems to be a certain postmodern flatlandish
ironism behind what you are saying, a deeper analysis
of what you said reveals that some of my buttons
were pushed to hard to remain silent.
Given the integral development of
my own work i have 5 different answers to you
and for easier reference will label them from

"Wilber-1" to "Wilber-5" **

1.) The Wilber-1 answer to your description is simply
that you missed the point because everything is Atman
and what your wrote is just another Atman-Project
meaning nothing, while the real Atman simply dwells
and abides as That... making everything else unreal, especially
you, (you little annoying critic!)

2.) For the Wilber-2 answer you have to take a
developmental-historical perspective on Consciousness to see
the real relevance or non-relevance of what you stated.
Out of the archaic primal Consciousness that constituted man
there was given rise to what Jean Gebser calls the magical-Structure.
This is when you create a picture of Something and dissociate
that Picture with Reality, not yet having any differentiation
between Self and Others. Don#T you see that this is exactly what you
did. Sham-an you!

3.) My Wilber-3 answer makes excessive use of an multidimensional
All-Quadrant-All-Level graphic which incorporates all true
approaches to everything anyone has ever thought, but unfortunately
it is too large to present her, so simply think of the Sky
over the Andes on a clear Novembernight. Your Statement
would be at  Coordinates 17;24;3 and could only be seen
with a Mega-Tescopy if you try really hard.
I reserved that place for you long tome ago.
Its located between Crazy Cat and Fatty Airbuckle....

4.) My Wilber-4 answer will be presented as a footnote to an essay
that will be published in the next months. What it comes down to
is that most critics have simply not understood what i am saying
and you are just another one if these guys.....

5.) With my Wilber-5 answer i just want to come back
to the essentials, so i just give a quote
of my soon to be published work
"The Integral Salon vs. The NonDuality-Saloon"
pg. 876-877:

Another reference to male centres of salons is the american culture
of "Salons" in the beginning of the settlements in the west.
Cultural Anthropolgy and Ethnologic studies give us an idea of how
and why the centres of these saloons were wild,male and totally
unorthodx in their admiration of integral-cowboy-ism.
Although thes "Salons" were called "Saloons" there mere existence is
an argument for our thesis that cannot be overssen: That here lies
the basis for every salon- might it be archaic, Magical, Mythical or
rational- and that out of the centre of these Saloons the true
spirirt evolved , which had nothing in common with the flatlandish
unbalanced approaches of the cultural-creative-relativism that
occupies our best Bars nowadays. In fact it was a wild orgy with
music, alcohol, cigarettes and girls that gives us an opprtunity to
acknowledge our ever-present nature in the midst of absurd card-
playing, shootings and comna-drinking. The female cultural saloon
of today could only arise from this historic-blueprint of the cowboy-
saloon because -as genderstudies clearly show- the male-centered
culture at that time was not ready for female-cyclic versions. So
both version are treu but must be seen in regard to their relative
histerycall-context. Only then the beauty of both of them
will shine in the eye of ever-drunken observer and the smell of the
blossoms of integral-salons will be a constant prayer in the noses of
theorginal face of everyone who really wants to party



** Note that this is an open-end Hierarchy which
reflects the state-of-the-art sociologic-psychological-scientific
approach to everything. On further Interest please read all of my
works. ***b23

***b23 This is an endnote to confuse you   -------------------  

-- another Egghead-simulation by: Martin
-- Postmetaphysic Integral Arch Kadosh Knight
-- of the Order of Conscious-Mechanical-Non-Action
--- pps.: i love Ken & his work

  The sun with all those planets revolving around it and dependent on it can
still ripen a bunch of grapes as if it had nothing else in the universe to do.

from Talking Stick Wisdom list  

Chris Damitio Gonzobeats list  

Ground Scores....

I've been having some incredible luck ground scoring to keep myself
with a little cash in my pocket.  Two days ago I found some books, a
hotplate, a bunch of litttle stuff, and a bike frame that my buddy
the Cajun helped me put a bunch of components off a broken old bike I
had it's a really comfortable bike that has all working
parts! I traded a couple of the other parts from the old bike for
things I needed at a local workers bike co-op here in SE Portland. 
Yesterday me and the Cajun rode all over Portland and I came back
with a backpack full of books I'm going to go try to sell at Powells

  Oh , by the way, for those of you unsure what groundscore is, it is
when you find something in a freebox on the sidewalk, or sitting next
to the dumpster. Basicly something you score off the ground.  The
best groundscore of the week was the bike frame but a close second is
a nearly complete set of Tarot cards. I replaced the missing cards
and have been getting t know the dcck. When I first got to Waikiki
and had no money, I would go out and give people gift readings with
the caveat..if you enjoy the reading or get something from it I
encourage you to give me a gift too. I got taken out to dinner, given
cash, smoked out,  etc. So finding this deck when I'm as strapped as
I am is a full on bonus. Also found some guitar books with a lot of
seventies songs in them to make my street musicaian performance that
much better.



Daily Dharma  

”The way of the Great Eastern Sun, is based on seeing that there is a natural source of radiance and brilliance in this world – which is the innate wakefulness of human beings.


The dawn of the Great Eastern Sun, is based on actual experience.  It is not a concept.  You realize that you can uplift yourself, that you can appreciate your existence as a human being.  Whether you are a gas station attendant or the president of your country doesn’t really matter.  When you experience the goodness of being alive, you can respect who and what you are.  You need not be intimidated by lots of bills to pay, diapers to change, food to cook, or papers to be filed.  Fundamentally, in spite of all these responsibilities, you begin to feel that it is a worthwhile situation to be a human being, to be alive, not afraid of death.” ~~Chogyam Trungpa

From the book,  “Shambhala, The Sacred Path of the Warrior,” published by Shambhala


Mystical-Poetry Competition Under Way

MADRID, Spain, JULY 7, 2003 ( The Fernando Rielo Foundation is looking for a few good mystical poets.

The group announced the competition for the 23rd World Award for Mystical Poetry, open to all unpublished books of poetry presented in Spanish or English.

The subject of the award is mystical poetry which, according to the organizers, is that poetry "which expresses the spiritual values of man in their most profound meaning."

The works must be presented by their authors, and must have 600 to 1,300 verses. Works translated into English or Spanish are also eligible to compete. The deadline for submission of originals is Oct. 15.

Fernando Rielo Pardal, founder of the Idente Missionaries, defines mystical poetry as the expression "with sufficient poetic dexterity of the diverse ways of the most intimate personal experience, in love and pain, that the soul has in its union with God: under the concept of the Most Holy Trinity, the Christian poet; under the concept of God alone, the non-Christian poet."

More details are at

Jan Barendrecht


a cosmic truth  -  truth as comic
political veracity  -  pictorially active
literal veracity  -  active artillery
                         -  vertical reality
bush senior sees  -  business heroes
the single veracity  -  hearty clients give
the scientific truth  -  fetch rich institute
life's veracity  -  actively fires
dual veracity  -  virtual decay
the nondual veracity  -  underneath vocality
an odd anagram - ramana and dog
undramatic - rumi and cat
mad irish fun - rumi and fish
just oneness - jesus, no nets!

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Nonduality: The Varieties of Expression Home

Jerry Katz
photography & writings

The wind carves shapes into the beach sand

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